>> charlie: welcome to our program. tonight we begin with laura linney from show time. >> there's something that happens when you read a script and your acr brain turns on. you start working before you finish it. you can't help yourself. your brain starts, your creative synapses start to fire and you start to see physicality or understand dialogue or you can see deeply into a character's life. and hen that starts to happen you have to pay tention. charlie: we continue with a conversation with the editorial director of interview magazine. >> in the fashion industry that's really connecting the time. like you go to a fashion show

you see an actor sitting there or actually posingor t ad now. an artist is involved into the campaign. so everything is kind of like all mixed together. what we like to do and what we're trying tdo is bri that point view and that mix of thing. >> charlie: we continue ts evening with la seduction. >> it's not about the process, it's not about the result. it's prolonging the pleasure, anticipation of the conquest much more than the conquest. the anticipation of the meal and the love affair. and then talking about it afterwards. if you've had a coke in the last 20 years, ( screams ) you've had a hand in giving college scholarships...

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rose communications from our studios in new york city, this is charlie rose. >> charlie: laura linney is here. ben bradley of the nobody times has called her an actress of emotional transparency. after studying at brown ask julliard she saw the stage like a homing pigeon. it was the film you can count on me that helped elevate her status to a knew lel. here's a look at her career. >> what's your favori year, maryann. >> i guess i don't really have one. >> oh. >> not yet. >> mm-mm. >> we had a great little fling,

you know. why push i is that okay? >> yes, sure, okay. you're right. >> so we're still friends. >> mm-mm, sure. >> all right. >> it's the king and the king knows what to do and does it. even when it's odd and daddy will do whatever he has to. it's simple.ñr >>çó hello hi, darling. no, no, i'm not busy. no, far away. right. yes. i'm not quite sure it's going to be possible to get the pope on the phone tonight. yes.ñr yes, i'm sure.

he's veryñr good another exorci. >> i've always been open to what you want. >> it's not that, you're the best partner a man's ever d. >> i'mjust not enough, is that it? >> you hadn affair for four years with that shrink that ruined our marriagend i can get the kids. i talk to eddy goodman that works on these cases all the time. i have an open and shut case. get in the car. >> sue me? you ly wanted joint custody because you pay less child support that way. >> not while there is a single british soldier remaining in america that cannot hold on. >> charl: linney is currently the star on the show time series the big c. here's a look at that series. >> the doctor.

oh, pardon me, sir. dr. sherman, hi. my name's kathy. >> i'm the nurse. >> you're not a drug rap, are you? >> no, no, i'm not. i'm a dying woman who is trying to see the right doctor and ask him if he s any advice on how to save my life. the best i can do is spend the last two hours a day on hold from your office to find out if anyone's canceled. that's not okay. >> i'm going to asyou to leave. >> i will not leave. >> charlie: the big c is currently airing on show time

mondays at 10:30 p.m. i'm pleased to have laura lean -- laura linney back at this table. >> thank you, charlie. >> charlie: when you look at that, what do you think? >> it's a weird, you know sort of tapestry of what you feel and i always feel slightly embarrassed when i look at myself. >> charlie: really? you don't look at this clinically and say i can't wait to have somebody watch it. >> i also good off camera. i give performances off camera to people who would never -- i mean, on camera i try my best. but there's, the further i get away from some of that material, i have a fondness for those prects. so i see kind see, you can count on me.

and at this point since i'm far enough away from them, i feel just happy that i had the experience. >> charlie: would you do anything differently? >> no. >> charlie: nothing? you'd take it the way it came? >> absolutely. yes, absolutely. i'm very very lucky that way. >> charlie: was training, academic -- whatever kind of training you had at brown and julliard important for you. >> incredibly important, incredibly. >> charlie: it gives you what, tools to be able to ... >> well, it give me a lot of different things. at brown, i learned, you know, or was starting to learn who i was, you know. that's the great thing about college, you go to college, you learn the academics but youlso learn what i like, what i don't like, who do i want to kiss, who do i not want to kiss. those of ings are really importt. so i hadñr a good, i had a great college education at brown. and then julliard was the perfect school for me. and a lot of people asked me, you know, whatxd was your bigçqo

julliard. that's the one thing that i can truly point to. >> charlie: it's tough to get in. they have a few slots r a lot of people. >> it is difficult to get in. god knows how i did it. i did a monologue about a belly dancer and a bad rendition of hermoine. >> crlie: did y leave julliard thinking i had within me the things to learn how to be good? >> no, i didn't have that arrogance at that point. >> charlie: when did the arrogance come? >> well, i am still trying to figure it out. but i knew that i had, i knew i wanted to try and apply what i had learned there to a working environment. and i'm still doing that, you know. i still go back to my notes from school. >> charlie: do you really? >> oh yes, i have like four books. >> charlie: what might i find

there? >> something that a teacher said that made no sense to me at all on the day but for some reason i should write that down. and then 15 years later you're like oh, oh that's what he meant. ha ha ha. and fortunately for someñi reasn i wrote it down. so i'm still using -- there's something so satisfying about, and i can remember the sort of period of time where i thought oh, i learned all this at school and now something in me clicked and i realize knew how topply it. so every opportunity i get to act, i'm sort of applying what i learned this or it's evolved into a different thing or you know i have the opportunity to approach something in a differt way. and then to see how that affects the work, does the work get better, does it work or not work. because so much of what happens or what doesn't happen on stage

or on screen or on television is the choices you make along the way. >> charlie: the choices you make along the way meang what? >> meani choices you make about character, meaning choices that you make about history, choices at you make not only creatively but technically. and sometimes you can overshoot something. it can be too heavy and the material won't hold it. it can be too light andhe material won't expand. so a lot of the tricky fun stuff for me is the chemistry. it's the scientific part of it. >> charlie: the analytical. >> tre's that, the analytical stuff.and then being able to dof that research or whatever it is u do and then throw it out the window, and then arrive onset and see who it is i'm looking at. because you never know what's going to happen. and to be too knowing i think is a downfall. being too prepared is a good thing. prepared, yes, knowing, there's

a diflesence. >> charlie: prepared, it's like overprepared for a conversation with somebody. >> sure. >> charlie: preparation helps you know all the options you have too. the spontaneity enables you to have a confidence to go wherever you want to go. >> yes. i -- i believe that if you are as prepared as you can be and you've done the right sort of work, then when you get to the sortf scary place of oh my god what's going to happen, you sort of can't make a wrong move. >> charlie: great. you've done film, you' done lots of film, you've doneñi broand now you're doing this series. before we talk about that, i asked you, were yñr at a place where you could choose and you said iñi don't know but at leasi have a choice. >> yes. >> charlie: pi that up. >> i have a voice now in how the

work develops. not a colossal voice, did you a voice. i'm one of a really special group of people who are doing the big c, and as an executive producer which was part of my agreement to doing a series. >> charlie: they said we want you to come and act in this and you said yes if i can be executive producer as well. >> yes. >>harlie: they said we want you that bad. >> and bob said absolutely. because i wanted to you learn also. i really wanted to learn. >> crlie: about. >> about production. >> charlie: right. >> about define the business. they don't like actors getting involved in quite frankly. there is a built of a prejudice, even now about actors being producers. it's sort ofñi seen as a vanity position. when you show up and y really do want to be, you really do want to know what's going on, you really do want to know how to be involved and when you actuallyave a point o view and experience to back that point of view up, people ge a little nervous. if they don't trust yet that

you're a team player. it takes a while f that t go away. >> charlie: because they project on to anybody the worst instinct which is is this something with vanity who wants to see their name as a producer or somebody who doesn't want to pay attention. >>he really doesn't know what she's talking about. and that can be a little bit in the air from people who haven't had the opportuni who are not really close to the working environment. but i think that went away pretty quickly, fortunately for me. and so i'm part of a great group of people for sony and at show time and our team onset. and i have a choice in who is cast and what is goingon and a little bit in story although i tend to leave the writers. i certainly pitch ideas to them or will voice something that i feel is, would be something i would like to see the show tackle or an issue that i think should go in there. >> charlie: what's the big c about? >> the big c is series about a

woman in kathy jamison whe been diagnod with stage four melanoma and it is about how she lived with her cancer and how it affects her identity, her family, her friends around her. and at's unique about it is 's aomedy. so it's comi from a very different perspective than most stories about someone with cancer. >> charlie: would you be attracted to this if it was not about someone with cancer but it was -- something else being equal but the story was not about cancer. >> yes. i think what i was interested in wasñr time. i was really interested in, because i had been thinking about it a lot anyway, you know, what time we have. it is limited. no one gets around that. it is a privilege to age. it is a privilege to grow old. and those are the things that i

was really thinking about. i don't understand in this country where the anti-age thing, you know logically it really makes no sense. for all of my friendsho have not had the privilege of a long life makes me really ary. i get insulted on their behalf. charlie: hose people who died. >> those people who didn't have the privilege of long life. so this story gives me the opportunity to keep sort of exploring all that, what do you do with the time. >> charlie: here's the scene in which yo husband paul, this is acene where you go to buy marijuana on the street. er, this ia comedy. here it is. >> wait here. >> no, you wait here. it's my headache, it's my illegal medication, i'll make

the transaction. >> okay. >> okay, p it inerçóñi your poct now, tweety. there you go. smooth. okay. >> charlie: there you go. >> there you go. >> charlie: ollie plat. >> ollie. >> charlie: did you have something to do with casting. >> i did and i very much wanted oliver. >> charlie: because? is this something he had done, an overall sense of character. >> it's that oliver's work has always made me laugh from a different place than anybody

else's work make me laugh i laugh from a profoundly deep place when i see oliver's work. and i wanted someone to play opposite who had sort of comic genius because i can be, you know, i think i can be funny, but i'm not, i don't have that kind of comic skill that he has. and i knew it would be important for the show to have that sort spirit around. so that's one of the great ings about being an executive producer, and because i know so many actors, i can, i certainly am a loud voice. >> charlie: is it simply obvious the fact that there are tons of people there who did not ha an opportunity. >> absolutely. >> charlie: to work. >> absolutely. particularly in this city in man hasn't. >> charlie: you could look across the table and say she has as much skill as i do. >> or more. >> charlie: she just has notñi had the same opportunity.

>> or more, much more. >> charlie: who decides who gets them and who doesn't. >> i have no idea. i really don't. i think there are some things that have helped me along the wayçó that i think has held me, and that's really the only sort of thing that i can talkbout this stuff. i'm grateful that i have a disposition that deals with rejection well. >> charlie: what's your disposition about rejection? >> you know, and i don't mind auditioning. i mean, it's not pleasant, it's never fun. >> charlie: have you been asked to addition and you didn't get it? >> oh tons. over and over. >> charlie: like five years? >> yeah, oh sure. absolutely. but for some reason i don't, i mean it always stings, it stings a little bit. usually not very long. and -- >> charlie: so you can simply

say look, i wa't what they wanted. it's not a value judgment about me? >> no. >> charlie: the next thing i might be or someone else might be. >> times when you addition you're checking them out. do i want to work with you. >> charlie: exactly. >> you can learn a lot very quickly about directors. >> charlie: between directors and actors. >> yes. u can see what kind of vocabulary they have, what kind of language they have, what sort understanding of wo they have, ho they aroach things. >> charlie: i've had this question asked a lot which is what do you expect from a director. >> at this point, i don't expect anything. ha ha ha. i expect, i hope for, i don't expect anything. i hope for some sense of understanding, a sense of trust that i really am there to tellñi this story and a sense of trusti

that there are certain things as far as acting's concerned, that i'm going to know a little bit more than they are just because it's my area of expertise. directing they're going to know a gazillion thingsment the when i'm working with directors, particularly first time directors, if i know this is a mont in the story that i'm not, i don't want to be too knowing about how it goes, i'll give them, i'll say let me just do one more a i'll give them an option like a watershed, what i call sort of watershed interpretation so if they want the story to totally shift a little bit at that point, they'll have the option. but i hope for understanding. i think that's what we really hope for is understanding. >> charlie: how about listen, you hope they will listen. >> we hope they'll listen. you hope that they're not to set in what they wan >> charlie: here's what amazes me about the question. it is that directors come here to this table and say thatñiñiñ%

of being a good director is the casting. you say then well that means in a sense you casts people because you believe in them and you lieve they can do the role and you had some judgment about this material and that actor's skil. there's not much to say to him othethan ... >> i think directors have so much on their minds. it's unbelievably -- >> charlie: it's a nightmare. >> there are people at you, up your nose and down your shirt asking a gazillion questions. if there's one thing they can put off their plate a little bit and don't have to hurry so much about an actor, that's a huge relief. it's a lot of work to really nurture a performance for someone that isn't quite right. the thing that always gets me that i'm still dumb founded by is how most, not most but a lot of executives, directors, see

actors and they really think that they have a range of about that much. and some actors do. some actors do have a range that much. >> charlie: then you shouldn't choose them. >> a good actor? most good actors have an enormous range. but so i'll hear people ta about certain actors and i just, i don't know how to contain my sense of oh, come o you know, really, like really, you think that's -- no, i'm, you know, i advertise every feeling i have on my face. i'm not terrible good at fluff. >> charlie: are you serious about this? in oer wor, you're communicatinto that director are you serious when you ask me this. >> yes, i'm surprised of like really, you don't think they can do anything else? no, they're like this. we, they have been that, but you don't want, for me, i will always try and goith the better actor as opposed to the actor that's right. they're right for it.

okay. but if you hav someone who is really great, you're going to get more than right. and i think everyone is so afraid that they don't have time, they don't have the time to try and nurture an actor or they'll even know what to say to nurture an actor. so there's a fear that they've got to get someone who can go there and hit it and do it. there's legitimate, that's a legitimate argument given the pressure people have with schedule, timend money. i understand that as well. >> charlie: have yohad times in which you look across wherever, in whatever scene you are and you look at the other actors and it's like hey we don't know what you're doing. >> yes. every once in a whi yo thin that and it's so good when it's cut together and they'll just like pop. oh my, what, wow. >> charlie: is that a director's skill then. a director knew how to put it together in a way. >> yes, absolutely. >> charlie: so the editing is what calls on the seen jt on of the director. >> absolutely and the genius of

the editor. you can have a laoser director and a great editor and the story will be okay. >> charlie: you take a great script and a great editor. >> you have a great director and great script and not a great editor, you're in trouble. >> charlie: now you're ecutive producer as well as star of the series. what does this mean in terms of your ambition to play that card out, being an executive producer, of being on both sides? >> just trying to do the next right thing for what the material is calling. >> charlie: if a great director came along and said i've got great material which calls for you and you say i'm here. >> oh yeah, absolutely. yes. >> charlie: how many times have you lost a role that you just wanted so deeply because you believe it was so right for you? >> a few times. >> charlie: a few. you can count them on your right hand.

>> most of them was stage stuff. >> really. >> yes. there's something that happens, i've talked about this a few times but there's something that happens when you read a script and your actor brain turns on. you start working before you finish it, you can't help yourself. your brain starts, your creative synapses start to fire and you art to see physicality or understand dialogue or you can see deeply into a charact's life. and when that starts to happen you ha to pay attention to what you're reading. a lot of times you can't listen to anyone else's advice. when you have that feeling, you just have to listen to it. >> charlie: and fight for it. thank you. >> nice to see you charlie. >> charlie: laura linney, the big c on show time, 10:30.

>> charlie: fabian baron is here. he's works wit the biggest names in fashions for the past 20 years. he redesigned five fashion magazines. his company, baron and baron creates anything and everything from advertising campaigns to product and packaging digns. he's also the editorial director of interview magazine. i am pleased to have him here at this table f the first time. glad to have you here.ñr what do you do? >> mm-mm, good question. that's a good start. i do, i think what i do is i create stories for companies. i create looks and style for coanies. and mostly fashion companies, i design groups, i design furniture, i design magazines, i design glasses, i design different things.

but most of all, i mean my carrier really started with magazines. >> charlie: was the harper's. >> no, it was probably in france in newspapers. so i started there when i was 17 years old. i was a kid around like doing the -- >> charlie: thinking you would be doing what? >> thinking i would be doing probably i work in a more senior position in a design field. but i never thought i would be able to design many different things. i do commercials, i direct commercials, i take pictures. i do a lot of different things but it's all visual-based. >> charli is there a central believe in it, a philosophy. >> i thin the is, yes. i believe in very direct things.

i believe in very ke stretch forward, very like to the point, you know, like clean up everything. so the point is very, sometimes it's very blunt. it's like what it is. and some people may think like it's too much. but u know, i think it's very, there's a certain allegiance to my work because i'm french and i've been educated like in an old fashion way, you know, like my father's an art director as well, so we were going to, you know, have business together, we were like looking at books and a lot of pictures and like the whole artistry. he taught me a lot. i kind of rebelled a little bit like when i moved to america when i was 20 years old in 1982.

>> charlie: you and liz had a woerful -- >> i loved z. i missed her so much. >> charlie: died of cancer at a young wage. >> the saddest part is like she contracted the disease like really at the beginning, it was bizae. so the first year she gothere, sh learned she had cancer and that was devastating. devastating. and she was very strong, very powerfuloman. the way she used people, the way she worked with people was the main thing about h that she was being able touse the talent and not stepping in a way too much about using them in the right way so she gets what she wants. so she had, she had very gentle but she was also very powerful and very strong. >> charlie: how does an

editor work with a design director. >> we talk a lot. we talk a lot and i try. >> charlie: you try to put -- >> i put things together. >> charlie: into images into words. >>çó içóxdñi put images into wo. >> charlie: to have a vision. >> yes, that's what i do. >> charlie: add to itçóñi to me it better. >> y. sometimes it's better than what they expected. you try you fail. but i keep on trying. >> charlie: which of them are you most proud of them. >> the medium is different. magazine would be something. i think would be thcalvin in my career is a great period. >> charlie: you d calvin are great friends. >> yes. on the other hand i love calvin, i love the man, i love the person, i love his character and

his personality. and love the way he was seeing things and i loved his vision that was also like very direct and very short, very to the point. >> charlie: what did he understand. >> i think he understood like from a designer point of view, i think he understood how to use the media and how to use advertising to enhanceis company. >> charlie: take a look at this campaign. this is one of two ad campaigns of calvin klein and ck1. here it is. ñiçóñi

>> charlie: very different campaign. >> totally different. that's calvin. that's calvin. he has that american style, very anchored like in the great sportswe are style and he has the american youth culture. and i think he was able to do

from collection all the wayñi dn to jeans, underwear, frag runs, he was able to talk to everyone. >> charlie: when did you come to interview >> i came to interview magazine about two years ago. >> charlie: what was the challenge? >> the challenge was to tak a magazine that basically was very successful at the point where the economy fell through and where like most of the advertisers are running away from magazines at the moment. and where like a newesign was needed and a new direction was needed. >> charlie: take a look at this firstli sde. ofis is k onde on the cover vint. iew what do we see there othern tha thti aulfube face of kate moss? >> thkinit was, i s heifooke ldit that it brisait youha byo b a little bit, like t reminds you of that.

>> charlie: you knew -- >> very little. i sat next to him a couple times. like a few words conversation with him but that's it, very casual. >> charlie: he created interview magazine. >> he created interview magazine and did an amazing job. >> charlie: it's amazing how much stuff he did. >> incredible. >> charlie: what are you going to do with interview. >> pop culture has changed drastically since andy warhol magazine and it's still a pop culture magazine. the interview has really like three souls in a way. you have it's connected to hollywood and entertainment business, it's connect to the fashion business. >> charlie: and to the music business a bit. >> the music, entertainment, vies, anything you, anything that's entertainment. the fashion business and also fashion and style.

and art. that's the three kez. >> charlie: world of entertainment, fashion and art. >> yes. >> so what we're trying to do is connect the three. actually like if you look at the way in the movies in art industry, in the fashion industry, i mean those three worlds really collecting. like you so and you see a actor posing there. now you have the campaign. so everything is kind of like, you know, all mixed together. and what we like to do and what we're trying to do is to bring that point of view, bring that mix of things in a new way and with photography that is really like different for that so the way we should actors and actresses is very different than the way you would see them in vogue or doing anything we don't

like. we have a different point of view so we're trying to do something different. >> charlie: what influences you? >> i think a little bit of everything. i think like you know television is a great influence. internet is a great influence. >> charlie: so you look at everything you can get your eyes on and whatever speaks to you incorporate that into the image you want to create. >> yes, you try. you try to do that. it's fascinating. like now with internet. >> charlie: like you can use computs today to design where before you couldt. >> y. technology is there. you can do anything. you can do anything in the movie business, you can do anything in music, you can do anything in sound. you can do any effect you want on the commercial, you can do any type you want, you can do

3-d, whatever you want. it's in the peuter. >> charlie: let me show you some other isad mnaon this is madonna onad the cover f harper's bizarre. an earlier madonna. tell me about it. >> oh. that was actually, it's>> very strange because manna anan i have beekind of like -- >> charlie: right, right. >> always, every time i change magazines, she ended up ineth e magazine. so she dd gudi s d vogue, she did french vog. ue >> crlie: why is that? because somehow you're in sync with respect. i don't kno ife're in sync because i think what she doing is much broader vision. >> charlie: you hire her. >> yes. i mean like she's great on the cover of the magazine. mazine likecr t i so i mean she amazing. i think she'srelyal le a

great subject matter. keand lily she was able to do so many different things with like creating so many different. >> charlie: here's a challenge, you may have already done this. lady gaga is the huge, big it's, largest pop culture person in the world today, huge. >> huge. >> charlie: if you put her on the cover of a magazine, let's take vogue. >> she was on the cover o vogue. >> charlie: what would you do? what kind of photograph would you look for? >> i think i would like to s her like normal. like the way she is. like really like a bare of all that stuff she uses. i would like to see that. i would like to see her in a pair of jeans and a white t-shirt and hair down and no make up and just like standing there in front of the camera and try to get intimacy.

>> charlie: you have a list of people. >> very specific. >> charlie: in other words, a certain look requires a certain photographer. >> exactly, exactly. i mean the concept usually it's the concept. if we don't like the concept we put something together that has like all the layering like so. we have a lot of meetings with like the marketing people. let's say we did a lot of fragrance, right, we work on the fragrance and sit down with the company and see what they are marketing with the next product. then we would get that approved and then we would assign the right team to it. the right photographer, the

right model, so we can successfully fulfill. >> charlie: what's the most challengin for you? >> i think it's to put the whole thing together. >> charlie: to make all the elements come together. >> yes. >> charlie: at the moment you want. >> because it's very difficult to get all the elements that you want. there's a lot of politics inñi thisusiness. >> charlie: politics in? >> between photographers and clients. >> charlie: some people don't wantto wk together. some peoe don't want to work tether. so you know, and you kind ofig up crews of people like themes you want to do a movie with. certain actors you want to work with. so you have this little clubs in the way the that do dif rlheha tt: d in n. >> charlie: the next thing is

an adampaign with calv klein's obsession. >>ca that's, i le that. and she loves it as wl. the great stephen mazel took the pictures. >> charlie: photographers can e best out of the model. >> yes, they do. that's part of their job. >> chaie: it's part of their job to speak to the model. >> and speak back to you through the picture. it's very important, like in this case. >> charlie: we think about people, lay people like me look at something that think we just happen, the guy showed up with his camera but it has to do with a whole range of sort of connections and understanding and mood and chatter and all of that stuff to get the moment that you're looking for. >> absolutely. >> charlie: it comes up out of that shoot. >> it's like you have to prepare, you kw, the same way

you do your show, everything's prepared in a certain way. there's a lot of preparation to do. so the thing when the day happened and she shows up and s e' shgewith she's withten mazel, everything runs perfectly and everybodynows what to do and just go ahead and do it n charlie: thenext thing are sea scapes. es that i durpict wi a largecameraan d basicallypi it's my personal wo. and these are pictures of the sea i've been taking for the past 30 years. >> charlie: the next one is another seascape. the next one is an ad campaign. the the next thing is an ad ca f agnaior hgnry winston. whoor is the model. >> fre. elodis a gre m. she is a chanel girl as well. >> charlie: next oneel is penelope cruz. an interview. for example i han't seen a picture like that of her before.

she is stunning and great. we dn't have much time. >> charlie: iwe was doing a profile six minutes of her so we went to one of these shoots with the producer and it's amazing just how good she was how when they needed her to perform she was ready. >>h yes. she's iredibly in th. that's one thing interview that i really enjoy is to work with these amazing people, a acts,ornd being ablekd havehem on shoots and like convince them to do certain things that make they wouldn't do otherwise and it's very interesting. >> charlie: have you toyed with the idea of making a movie. >> y. >> charlie so will you? >> i'd love to do a film. it would be really really interesting. the only thing is the time it would take. in the commercials, i mean like the things, like the shoot took a few days there's a lot of meetings and preparations, spend a lot of money. we work with the best people,

the best director of photography, the best lighting people, sometimes some actors and everything like, you know, but it's short. >> charlie: what's short. >> 60 to tell the story. you try to capture -- >> charlie: simplicity is best. >> yes. the most simple the better. the directorness is always workinthe best. >> charlie: thank you, pleasure to have you here. >> same here. >> charlie: elaine sciolino is here. she's worked in france she's a paris correspondent and a f amer paris bureau chief for the "new york times." she's come to know france. her new book is called la seduction. i'm pleased to have her back at this tain. iake two notes first of all

she was a very distinguished national corspondent that's when i first got to know her. we both have an interest and continue to the way t world works. and i congratulate her on her work. >> thank you. i congratulate you too. >> charlie: thank you. tell me about what you're doing. you have made a decision to stay inaris because of a love affair with paris or what? >> because of a love affair with paris but because of a love affairith my husband. when the "new york times" offered me the job of paris bureau chef in 2002, andy, my husband and i decided we really wanted this french experience for us and our children. >> charlie: had you had a french experience before that. >> never. >> charlie: just to visit and cover a story. >> to visit and vacation but he had pretty good french from public high school and he joined a french law firm. he's the only amican in a french law firm. he passed the french bar.

he wears fnch cufflinks and french cuffs. >> charlie: do you speak french all the time there or english and french. we speak glish in home and we can't even spe french in front ofhe ki anymore because they speak french but we decided to stay. >> charlie: because of his profession as much yours. >> y asuch as his professio as much as me. i'm finishing up the publicity for the book which just came out two weeks ago and working for the "new york times." sot's pretty good, touch wood. >> charlie: what's the magic of paris for you? >> the magic is, there's always a surprise. we've been there nine years now and you turn a corner and there's something new to see. there's a new building, there's a new resurant, the's a new shop. i walk down the street to my corner. i know the name of the green grocery, ali, the kiosk guy,

bahime, mark the fish monger. you can't walk alone in ris, you're part of a community. >> charlie: is france relevant today? >> france is relevant. france thinks it's more relevant than it really is. >> charlie: because of libya. >> no because it's a memberf securi council, the united nations, it has veto power, it's a nuclear power. it can proje power militarily so in afghanistan and libya. president sarkozy is wanting the g-8 this year but it' only the size of texas and with an economy that's probably the size ofalifnia. >> charlie: yes. how is he doing? president sarkozy. >> we're in a period of track cision, in part because of what happened because of -- who could have been the social es party candidate and wa leading inhe poll in any combination >> charlie: against sarkozy. >> exactly.

it's out of the picture. even though tzar -- tzar sarkozy -- >> charlie: at the likely to be the nominee. >> no clue. i would like to see francois who is really smart and funny and not seductive enough for the french people. >> charlie: he was head of the socialist party and his wife, n his wife -- >> father of their four children. >> charlie: she got the nomination. >> right. >> charlie: is she still going to run or not? theye no longetogether and he could be running and she could be running and they were -- >> she would like to run again. but there's another woman in the picture who is more to the left on the socialist party fro. so it's going to be a very very

interesting contest for who gets the nomination. >> charlie: what is this book about, la seduction, how the french play the game of life. >> it's a book that started just by chance i gave a speak at the new york public library on francend i didn't want to be boring and talk about france and afghanistan or france returning to the military wing of anyway though and my editor from my book, my last book on iran and says elaine you talk about seduction this is your next book. i'm explaining how seductions the key to understanding frenchm private life. >> charlie: you began with this quote from voltaire it is not enough to conquer one must also know how to seduce. >> you know france charlie better than i do. it's all about process not about getting the end result. it's about prolonging the pleasure, the anticipation of the conquest, much more than the conquest. the ticipation of the meal, the anticipation of the love

affair. and then talking about it afterwards. >> charlie: i once saw at a dinner some middle age french minute and women and they were all talking about how their children were going to school in london, going to schooin the united states and how they thought they might stay there because they're in love with sort of the internet and socia media and those kinds of issues so they thought they would find their careerthere and said what about you andthey said no no no, for us it's the quality of life. >> well it's interesting you say this because once i nt out t i should say which is one of the great iversities and i talked to a group of young people and they all wanted to go to england or america or australia to sort of make their career but they all said of course we'll come back to settle and have our second home in the country. >> charlie: so tell me about seduction, what we know about seduction from the french. >> seduction has a very different meaning for the french than it does for us americans.

it's much more than a sortf sexual connotation. it has to do with charm and anticipation and playfulness, and when the french say -- it can mean operation seduction to refer to their campaign in afghanistan or sarkozy seducing the parliament. >> charlie: you talked to a wide range of people. who gave you the most interesting responses to this one. >> that's a hard one. someone like -- put his hands to his white shirt and rubbed his hand against his chest and said seduction is life. or carla bruni, you just had to listen to the voice. she talks to you in such a soft

loving voice i fell in love with the voice. >> charlie: that marriage has de the birth of a child has de him wk to his political advante. >> it hasn't bumped him up in the polls, this is what's so interesting, the fact she's pregnant that she's maternal now. this is a woman who had quite an active social life before he came into her life. the fact she's pregnant and looking at not like a super model music star but a mother to be has not bumped him up. but i don't write off sarkozy because the last time around he ran a brilliant campaign, he was extraordinarily disciplined and he prevailed. >> charlie: how is france different in terms owomen and men? it is often said that en bill clinton had those issues that led to votes in the house andin the senate that the french said

what is this about, we don't understand. >>he french still say what is this about. to this day, the french do not understand why there was such a big deal that bill clinton was involvedith an intern. in part because french politicians are expected to have an active sexual life. it goes back to the tradition of the kings. and in the book i talk at length abt the history of politicians and the importance of virility and not just virility in terms of personality but in terms of potency. the french at the time of the bill clinton affair thought this was a great idea that he could be so virile and potent. the only thing that surprised him was that monica lewinski wasn't more beautiful. >> charlie: how did you enjoy writing this book. >> i loved it. >> charlie: but it was hard. >> it was harder than my last book which was on iran because with iran i owned the material,

i owned the story. but with france it's a huge challenge becausi approached the subject with great humility because so many people know about france and it took long to get this right. >>harlie: the fd and the life-style and quality of life and those who say well yes that's not true but it's really just a museum, what do you say? >> i say you turn any corner and you will be surprised. that's why itay thereecause it's a constant conversation with the landscape, with the people, with the art wh the culture, with the food, withittm and it's where we're making our lives because of that. >> charlie: this book is called la seduction with elaine sciolino .